Author Topic: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?  (Read 4888 times)

Brad

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Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« on: August 10, 2015, 10:35:13 PM »
Apple has Passbook on its closed system, Google has Google Wallet, Paypal has an app and every credit card company has or will have an app, so who do you trust with your credit card payment info to pay for those donuts and coffee in the morning, groceries and stuff at stores?

Me I know nothing about them, except right now I'd put my trust into Apple for security.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2015, 11:01:55 PM »
None that connect in any way to your primary bank accounts.  I would consider one that you could fund with visa gift cards, say, in $200 increments.

Brad

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2015, 12:52:05 AM »
For me I'm thinking credit cards IF, and only if, I have the same $50 limit on liability for false charges.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2015, 01:05:08 AM »
In the US, a personal credit card does have the $50 limit. A debit card or business credit card has no protection.  That said, responding/replacing funds is still somewhat at the bank's discretion and it can take a considerable amount of time, effort, and paperwork on your part.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2015, 01:11:52 AM »
<added>

What concerns me is that you may provide a gateway into your bank's system --data security there is pretty much crap. Internally, your various account are cross-connected and you might end up with a bank draft to the Ukraine out of your money market.

Brad

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2015, 01:45:48 AM »
I don't ever allow electronic access to my bank accounts except to the one tied to Paypal, which only has a minimum balance.  I don't even have a debit card or ATM card, they scare me.  No electronic banking either.  I'm a Luddite.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2015, 02:00:51 PM »
>electronic access to my bank accounts except to the one tied to Paypal

I used to think I had mine locked down in just the same way. Even had "no electronic transfers" written on my signature cards.  But, in the late 90s or later, the gov quietly changed the banking laws to allow big dog corporations to convert your printed checks to a draft. The gov has also slowly added mandates for EFT to pay them taxes faster.  The end effect is that all accounts are open to eft by default and, in some cases, with no option to shut the hole in your defenses.

Banks, btw, have been paying ransom to keep fraudulent access out of the news --bad PR.  They don't even report it to the feds.

In short, your options are to risk it and hope you're not among the unlucky OR limit the risk by silo-ing it in a stand-alone account in a stand-alone bank not used for any other purpose.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2015, 02:58:48 PM »
I belong to a forum for old geezers in motorhomes. This demographic is notoriously conservative/paranoid about online tracking and security but -paradoxically- flocks to online banking.  Here is a paste of some links I've dumped on them:

http://247wallst.com/banking-finance/2014/10/05/jpmorgan-not-the-only-bank-hacked/

http://lifehacker.com/chase-bank-hacked-info-stolen-for-83-million-accounts-1642063956

http://money.cnn.com/2014/11/18/technology/security/congress-bank-hack/

http://krebsonsecurity.com/tag/first-sentry-bank/

>$50

AFTER you file fraud papers and wait. Been there. Except I didn't have to wait as I had a handwritten note on my signature card "No electronic transfers." I told Wachovia to have the $9k back in the account by 2pm. They did. (The US has since passed a banking law that trumps that signature card trick, btw.)

And only individuals are protected....

"In the United States, consumers have little to no liability if a computer infection from a banking Trojan leads to the emptying of their bank accounts -- provided that victims alert their bank in a timely manner. Businesses of all sizes, however, enjoy no such protection, with many small business owners shockingly unaware of the risks of banking online."

http://krebsonsecurity.com/tag/first-foundation-bank/

And we haven't even talked about skimmers yet.

Your bank can take up to 10 days to reimburse money while it investigates fraudulent ATM or online use, and up to 20 days if the fraudulent transaction took place at a location such as a store or restaurant. In the meantime, your other legitimate transactions will not be covered. Not so bad if you're around home and can respond quickly. Traveling? S.O.L.

WSJ: http://blogs.wsj.com/wallet/2009/03/27/help-my-checking-account-was-hacked/

Gigaom: https://gigaom.com/2013/08/07/how-scammers-drained-1700-from-my-bank-account-using-starbucks-cards/

LA Times: http://articles.latimes.com/2006/jan/01/local/me-lopez1

The takeaway is that personal accounts have protection but it will be a PITA to resolve. Debit cards are a disaster waiting to happen and have less protection. Your ATM card is probably a debit card now, btw. After paper checks to vendors-known-to-you, Your safest bet is doing everything by personal credit card.

Business accounts and business credit cards have little or no protection. Even banks aren't very aware of this, particularly at the local service rep level. I was on the board of directors of a substantial bank and -even then, I couldn't get a solid, well-researched answer from the legal department without raising hell. If you have business c-cards, kill them or at least reduce the $-limit to act as a firestop. I carry separate personal cards with my business name on them. The cc bill is paid by the company but they are technically personal cards (with relatively low $-limits).

For either personal or business, I think the greatest risk is in "the last mile" rather than the banking system. Think that crackhead gas station attendant or waiter can't read your pin# keystrokes upside-down? Then there are skimmers and loggers on the electronic side.

(Brad ===>) You pay -one way or another- for every convenience.


JasonD

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2015, 03:24:10 PM »
You're all way more paranoid than me. I gave any pretence at not trusting in the system and everything that goes with that, eons ago

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2015, 05:44:28 PM »
My general feeling is that consumers have more real protection against the corporate overlords in UK and northern EU.  Here, much of it is marketing bullshit designed to make people/voters *think* their interests are a concern. It also feels like that's changing a little in EU and -particularly- AU, that those countries are listening more & more to lobbyists. 

Mackin USA

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2015, 08:53:45 PM »
Speaking of BANKS & ONLINE

What do you think of http://www.ally.com/

I'm an OLD conservative but I'm looking into these MFs  ;D
Mr. Mackin
MikeMackin@affiliatemanager.com

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2015, 09:08:38 PM »
>ally

They are a re-name of GMAC.  More in private....

Drastic

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2015, 01:21:08 PM »
I use CC for everything I buy. Nobody gets my bank account info, especially paypal.

For receiving money I have a deposit-only UPIC account at my bank. Paypal, or any other merchant services company, can't take funds away from any checking accounts.


Rumbas

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2015, 01:30:42 PM »
>who do you trust

No-one and all of them. I don't trust them, but use Paypal and cc's a lot. Haven't added my bank info anywhere - afaik.

rcjordan

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Re: Which Digital Wallet do you trust?
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2015, 01:36:14 PM »
There is an unconfirmed article on my newsfeeds that paypal was hacked.  We'll see how that shakes out.

Paypal kept bugging me for years to 'verify' by linking to my checking account. No way!