The Core
Why We Are Here => Water Cooler => Topic started by: rcjordan on October 21, 2017, 03:37:47 PM
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http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-41704949
https://www.facebook.com/RobertScoble/posts/10155785962004655
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This is going to be huge for you.
We had Jimmy Saville and operation Yew Tree.
In some cases politicians getting knighted despite being known peadophles etc etc
About time things changed.
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>"I have made many steps in my life to try to improve, including getting sober more than two years ago,” he wrote.
Well, not last year in Vegas..
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At least he is not wearing Google Glassed whilst naked.
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Jeez, it's getting to be a CEO bloodbath over here.
Scoble Resigns From His Consulting Company
https://www.buzzfeed.com/doree/robert-scoble-resigns-from-his-consulting-company-in-the
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It’s beginning to look like there’s a “Weinstein effect”
Beginning?!!?
https://www.fastcompany.com/40485650/its-beginning-to-look-like-theres-a-weinstein-effect
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It's even hitting b-list and under people. A gaming forum I frequent went offline a few days and has been in the news over the owner getting a metoo.
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Going international:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-41794625
Seriously, you just can't call your assistant 'sugar t##s' anymore.
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Wow, I thought you were exaggerating/joking. It's almost funny.
Our county sheriff is now on the chopping block as well.
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And interestingly, a certain person who said that if your a star you can just grab p###y anytime you want does not seem to have had any career repercussions.
Why? If powerful, big-money people *need* you, there is insulation to be bought. Insulation is not protection, as O'Reilly found out... but they were willing to pony up $23m for his contract and over $32m to keep it quiet.
With Trump, he had one singular virtue that convinced almost the entire Republican establishment to keep quiet about his sexual harassment and assault- he was not Hilary Clinton. If Trump had lost, though, you can bet the entire Republican establishment would have descended on him with holier-than-thou statements about how his history of sexual assault hurt him among women and cost the party the presidency. He was just one Jim Comey letter away from that fate.
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I think that a lot of this in the US is an outcropping along the same vein as the Pussyhat movement a few months ago.
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Oh man, reddit is not going to like this one.
George Takei Accused of Sexually Assaulting Former Model in 1981
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/george-takei-accused-sexually-assaulting-model-1981-1056698
>Our county sheriff is now on the chopping block as well.
From the headlines going by, our statehouses across the country are not going to have many men left.
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All of this reminds me of one of the most useful concepts in history/sociology of social mores.
Norbert Elias was a German Jewish sociologist writing in the 1930s (which is why his work didn't get a lot of attention until republication in the 1960s) who did a survey of manner books from the Middles Ages on.
He had a concept of the "threshold of shame." Essentially, we talk about things that are in the threshold, but not on either side.
There are many examples, but take the example of spitting on the floor at dinner. This is something that is never mentioned in medieval manner books. It starts to get mentioned in the late Middle Ages and is commonly discussed in the Early Modern period with famous intellectuals weighing in. Then it disappears from manner books. Of course, what is happening is that in the early period, it isn't discussed because it is universally accepted. In the later period it isn't discussed because probably none of us have had the experience of inviting a dinner guest to our house who regularly spat on the floor throughout dinner.
But in the transitional period, it gets discussed a lot. And keep in mind, we're talking about long time scales here. With the spitting example, the transitional period is a couple of centuries.
And of course, it works the other way. Until recently we didn't really have discussions regarding the morality of gay marriage. It was simply unthinkable. Most of Christian Europe applied the death penalty to gay sex without reflection or remorse. It wasn't necessary, in fact not even possible, to have a discussion of letting "those people" actually marry. It was outside the conceptual realm for the average European, including homosexuals, 100 years ago.
So when I see these watershed moments when the dam breaks loose and a behavior that was tolerated (to greater and lesser degrees) for centuries suddenly becomes completely unacceptable, we are fully in the middle of the threshold of shame. And by that I mean that the moralists have rendered judgement, but behavior has not caught up.
The strange thing with this one is that most of the behaviors in question would have been seriously punished in 16th century Geneva (uh... I spent about 20 years full-time studying, for lack of a better term, a "morals" court in Geneva for the period 1541 to 1564). The reason, of course, was the control of extramarital sexuality rather than aggression against women.
We crossed the extramarital sex threshold first and are only now crossing the aggression against women threshold and in the intervening long period, women were at greater risk than they were earlier and later.
So we have a situation where men acted in an era when their behavior was clearly deemed wrong, but was permitted because moral prescription did not match moral enforcement and quite often the blame was assigned to the women. But as we pass through the threshold and we leave behind blaming the victim, and looking the other way, and saying "it's locker room talk" on the far side of the threshold, we end up in this moment we're in.
And sadly, because most of my life has been spent on the other side of the threshold, I had no clue that this was so prevalent (as is always the case before the threshold of shame is entered). So many articles are taunting people who are shocked to find out how common this is, but in all honesty, I'm shocked.
As a teaching assistant, we had to go through sexual harassment training and it seemed so ridiculous. I remember everyone laughing when the video showed a "more marginal case" of harassment since everyone in the room thought it was absurdly blatant. I think everyone in the room thought the video makers were just really bad and portraying subtlety. I think back on it now and realize that the "subtle" cases were probably happening daily on our large campus.
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US Congress has a secret sexual harassment slush fund.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/10/taxpayer-piggy-bank-lets-congress-settle-sexual-harassment-cases-in-secret.html
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>"threshold of shame."
Damn fine post there and makes intuitive sense with the way all this is unfolding.
I suspect the timing is very Trump related -- like his making those comments and getting elected anyway was a trip-wire that caused this explosion.
RC, there is so much infuriating in that article.
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>there is so much infuriating in that article.
And note who ran it --Fox!!
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I suspect the timing is very Trump related
I think so too, but not exclusively. I looked up the dates. It was May 25 when the judge ruled that Bill Cosby would stand trial. It wasn't until October that the Access Hollywood tapes came out.
Trump is part of it, but I think there's a "cultural moment" happening and I think it would have happened with or without Trump, but the timing might have changed by a bit.
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>Cosby
Why is this happening now? The geyser of women’s stories — and to a lesser extent, men’s — of celebrity assault began when the Bill Cosby case cracked the wall of silence and then Harvey Weinstein gave it another tap, the edifice topped and the torrent of pain and outrage roared through.
https://chicago.suntimes.com/columnists/sexual-harassment-assault-politicans-celebrities-organized-religion-women/
I also tend to agree with the premise of the article.
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France could introduce a law to rule that anyone aged under 13 is automatically considered unable to consent to sex after a 28-year-old man was acquitted of raping an 11-year-old because the relations were deemed consensual.
https://www.thelocal.fr/20171113/france-could-set-legal-age-of-sexual-consent-at-13-after-man-acquitted-of-raping-11-year-old
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SNL is on the case....
SNL’s most relevant new character: a fed-up HR rep fielding constant sexual harassment
It's been a crazy week.
I haven't been home in three days.
https://www.vox.com/culture/2017/11/12/16639152/snl-sexual-harassment-claire-from-hr-cecily-strong
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It's all theatrics until they agree to quit secretly funding it.
Congress just made sexual harassment prevention training mandatory for all lawmakers and their staff
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/11/10/16633322/congress-mandatory-sexual-harassment-training
>US Congress has a secret sexual harassment slush fund.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/10/taxpayer-piggy-bank-lets-congress-settle-sexual-harassment-cases-in-secret.html
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Regarding the "threshold of shame" idea, this article from today is essential reading.
Interview with the women who wrote the 1989 expose on James Toback sexual predation that went nowhere until now
There was no mechanism at the time for really dealing with male harassment. It was very common. It was not something that would have jumped out as utterly inappropriate. Because it was so ubiquitous. It was just something that women dealt with all time. You know, it didn't raise eyebrows.
https://www.vox.com/conversations/2017/11/14/16634660/james-toback-sexual-harassment-weinstein-effect
And the linked post mentioned in the interview to James Gunn's Facebook post where he said he had been warning people about Toback for years
A few people on here, Twitter, and other sites are saying, "James, why didn't you say anything if you knew this was happening?"
A) Like I said above, I did say something, many times, to many people, all over the world.
B) More importantly, I have publicly written Facebook posts about Toback and what he was doing, as well as mentioning him on my web site and on MySpace. I don't know why suddenly people are just assuming I didn't just because I don't mention it here.
So despite numerous people publicly outing Toback going back almost 30 years, he remained completely untouched by the allegations until right now because "it didn't raise eyebrows."
That's basically the definition of a threshold of shame phenomenon
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Sen. Al Franken, put your head between your knees and kiss your a## goodbye.
http://www.kabc.com/2017/11/16/leeann-tweeden-on-senator-al-franken/
TL;DR - Scroll down to the pix.
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>>Scroll down to the pix
Hard to deny that one.
I suspect soon there will be some celebrity/politician who will get out ahead of the game and admit a past indiscretion before being called out. I think the reaction will be more positive that they were willing to admit their mistakes and be forthcoming about it. If that announcement is tied to a big donation to a women's charity of some sort all the better. It won't change that they screwed up but the public perception will be better. I think.
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Now top story on G News. I scooped 'em by a couple of hours.
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He's apologized and is using the very shop-worn Reagan Defense.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/al-franken-apologizes-radio-anchor-forcibly-kissed-lewd/story?id=51196065
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The video where Tweeden talks about it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkTvGjSW7v0
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If Moore goes the GOP will see to it that Franken goes along with him.
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I suspect soon there will be some celebrity/politician who will get out ahead of the game and admit a past indiscretion before being called out.
I think most of them look at their past behavior and see normal, healthy, legal activity and are shocked, truly SHOCKED but the allegations against them.
I've been thinking that my life as a somewhat shy nerd (despite, perhaps, my online persona) with no power has been a great protection for me against wrongdoing, regardless of my morality or lack thereof.
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>SHOCKED
And others who are wondering if they've done anything that is going to come back at them.
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>others who are wondering if they've done anything that is going to come back at them.
Well, at least I'm pretty sure there aren't any pictures.
Uumm, wait! I don't remember!
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It’s beginning to look like there’s a “Weinstein effect”
(said in deep husky voiceover style voice)
"The Weinstein Effect. A Stark, Terrifying Vision of the Future, trying to come at a cinema near you, soon."
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The apparently justifiable slaughter continues. Whew!
The media is now on zero-tolerance when it comes to their own. Just a whiff and -bam!- you're out.
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>Just a whiff and -bam!- you're out.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/29/567241644/garrison-keillor-accused-of-inappropriate-behavior-minnesota-public-radio-says
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Charlie Rose (maybe a few whiffs)
Matt Lauer
http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/29/media/matt-lauer/index.html
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Out of all the revaluations/accusations so far Keillor threw me the most.
For the Brits: This guy is like a grandpa figure that has been doing a "small town" variety show since the 1970s -- pretty much the epitome of wholesome.
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I've been watching this thread with interest.
I could post more than one #metoo ... from a range of inappropriate words and touches to being flashed by a stranger on a public sidewalk in broad daylight. That last happened when I was a teenager and at the time it never occurred to me to call the police or even to tell my parents.
>> It was just something that women dealt with all time. You know, it didn't raise eyebrows.
Yup.
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>>For the Brits: This guy is like a grandpa figure that has been doing a "small town" variety show since the 1970s -- pretty much the epitome of wholesome.
Sounds like the equivalent of our (or can we give him back to Australia now?) Rolf Harris - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolf_Harris
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Reports are surfacing that Franken will resign.
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Reddit just posted what was supposed to be a funny, but it turned out being somewhat introspective.
Pepe Le Pew fired from Warner Bros Amid Alleged Sexual Harassment Allegations
Then someone brought up Johnny Bravo. Hoo boy!
https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/7ifq3x/pepe_le_pew_fired_from_warner_bros_amid_alleged/
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. Andrea Ramsey, a Democratic candidate for Congress, will drop out of the race after the Kansas City Star asked her about accusations in a 2005 lawsuit that she sexually harassed and retaliated against a male subordinate who said he had rejected her advances.
Multiple sources with knowledge of the case told The Star that the man reached a settlement with LabOne, the company where Ramsey was executive vice president of human resources. Court documents show that the man, Gary Funkhouser, and LabOne agreed to dismiss the case permanently after mediation in 2006.
http://amp.kansascity.com/news/politics-government/article189931704.html
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>>executive vice president of human resources
I wonder if she was involved in sexual harrassment training at any point in her career.
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Ha, maybe. As far as I know this is the fist instance where a woman has been accused since the #metoo movement started.
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Sir Ian just lit a fuse.
http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/movies/actresses-used-sex-offers-to-take-advantage-of-casting-system-sir-ian-mckellen-says-20171219-h07hhk.html
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>Why is this happening now
I'll add that The Handmaid's Tale was running (to rave reviews) during this. I think this series had a powerful effect on the pussyhat/metoo movement.