Th3 Core

Watched it.

There is a lot of anecdotal stuff in the documentary, but not a lot of science.  I think one can make a very good moral argument for being a vegan, and a person can probably be healthier eating a smart vegan diet than the typical standard American or British diet.

Some notes:
I am not sure why lipids in the blood are a bad thing, lipids can be used for fuel -- in fact, I don't think it is possible to lose body fat without lipids in the blood to transfer energy to cells.

Humans are not that well equipped to extract protein from plants.  In the doc it shows the digestive track of a carnivore vs. a human.  If we were to look at our digestive track compared to a plant eating animal, like a cow or deer, it is nothing like what they have to process the nutrients out of plants.  Even the gorilla is much more equipped to eat plant matter than humans, it has a much bigger colon filled with bacteria to help with plant matter breakdown.

The doc also spent a lot of time talking about the inflammatory properties of meat, but didn't mention that there is a lot of evidence that grains and sugar are a major contributor to inflammation.

Veganism is only possible in post-agrarian societies.  There is no way a person would be able to extract enough calories and nutrients from plants alone in a natural environment.  Our brains are huge (relatively) and take up 20% of our energy yet our guts are quite small.

The glucose being required to fuel the brain claim is not true, the body will make ketones if glucose is not available and the brain will be just fine.

My last point:  It is pretty clear that humans evolved as omnivores if you look at indigenous diets all over the world.

I didn't watch it yet, but this guy spends an hour refuting many of the claims of the documentary.

Ah, some sense, thank you

I watched it last night and came away actually feeling quite down about it.  Because it would mean Mum is right. At 85 she has only just given up on tennis, and her diet is very much vegan. I see a lot of old folks these days, and occasionally come across others of a similar age to Mum, and they are strong and healthy too. And vegan. Not many, as the diet is not popular with that age group, and maybe I see it because of Mum.  But its there, but again anecdotal.

However, the story felt wrong, and I felt that the test groups all seemed small, and the differences they felt could be a very personal thing. If it made such a huge difference in the performance of athletes, with the money involved, they would all be vegan.

I know little really about the science.
and bingo:

There is a lot of anecdotal stuff in the documentary, but not a lot of science.

I spotted that too.

The thing is I LOVE eating meat. And Drinking milk. And Eggs. And Cheese. I skip puddings, and go straight for the cheese board. I like rice and potatoes and pasta, but seriously, aren't they just fillers for the meal?  Making sure it is balanced?

OK I know, sugar is the same. And I know to try hard to leave that alone.  So what your body craves is not necessarily good for you. But the sugar we eat is processed, so it is new, and yes I do believe it is killing us. And everything in moderation (My Dads saying, and TBH he did not mean it. The moderation part, but not the everything)

Thanks for the links Guys, and some of the science I did not know, and the other perspectives. 

Already feeling better this morning!

I watched it and pretty much agree with LM and also Ruperts moderation comment.

We seem to have lost the connection with food in the west. It is one of the things I find attractive in Vietnam, this food is good for a cold, this one good for a fever. We call them old wives tales in the UK but I think there is some truth in it, big pharma can't make any money off it though.

In Vietnam as an example many people keep chickens, they have to kill them and eat them, a real connection with food. Pigs too, I have a friend from a little village and for the New Year (which is a really big deal) they kill a pig and use every part of it.  Restaurants commonly display a picture of the animal rather than the "meat" if that makes sense. And they eat *all* of the animal, and I mean ALL.

My brothers and sisters from here who visited Vietnam may know what my wife's favourite food is, just to emphasise she eats all the animal.

Very reminiscent of my grandparents generation in the UK who also grew their own vegetables, as did everybody in those times. Food rationing (WW2) didn't end until 1956 which shocked me a little when I found that out.

Just had a quick trip to Italy, Solomeo, same there a real connection with the land/food/animals and the company I visited had a 1 1/2 hour lunch break. In UK it's a Sainburys meal deal eaten at a desk. I think there was a Jamie Oliver show where he showed a bunch of vegetables to both UK and Italian school children. The UK kids didn't even know what a potato was.

I think using animals on a production line basis is just plain wrong. I have a friend who bought a big plot of land, he fancied being a chicken farmer. His neighbour was a chicken farmer so he paid a visit. A big truck arrives loaded with chicks, it gets weighed, a few weeks later they come back and he gets paid on the difference in weight. That's just plain wrong.

And I think that is a real rub.... affordability.

Ashbourne has loads of chicken farms...  32 days I think is the life. Its about that. They all supply a local factory.

Its illegal to kill your own animals in the UK, unless you are shooting pheasant or grouse. (Not sure if that is the only one? Rabbits perhaps)

And most do not have the land to rear chickens and pigs.  We are too crowded.

Factory meat is soo cheap. I sometimes pick up a big Mac and fries for lunch for £1.99. How do they do that? 800 calories. I know its bad food. But Its fast, and I am in a rush.


That is a noisy thread!

More expensive? wow, that is a surprise.  So convenience and/or expectation?

Probably right.

https://peterattiamd.com/191027/

signed up.

>eat everything

There's an old-timey saying here in NC; "We use everything but the oink."

I like souse-meat followed by a bite of hoop cheese.  There's still one country butcher near here who has it fresh.

I grew up on collards with pigtails.

>VN chicken prices

That's because you don't have the industrial chicken farms.  Same for pork.  There's a reason China bought our largest pork producer, we do meat cheap.  AFAIK, the industrialized chicken or pork farms started in my region.  There's an interesting story in our local paper
http://www.dailyadvance.com/News/2019/10/26/Parker-Changes-made-NC-pork-leader.html

Related:  There is an egg farm about 40 miles south of here.  After one recent hurricane damaged it, there were headlines that there might be employee lay-offs and egg shortages because this one farm produces 2 million eggs per day.