I know, via repeated admonishments, that I tend to be a little, ummm, brusque at times. But, really, I'm getting tired of these wussies.
I'm curious, what are you talking about specifically?
I'm having to carefully word every f###ing thing I say so they won't get their feelings hurt or take offense at something they are *sure* I must be implying. It's like talking to 13 yr olds.
<added>
30-40 age. out in the bricks. not here.
[cross-posted. wrote this before your response]
Yeah, this makes no sense to me. You're obviously in touch with your emotions - you just posted about them here. I try to be in touch with, but ideally somewhat in control of, my emotions. It's a fundamental for a rich life.
You're clearly thinking of some specific behavior of, perhaps, the offspring of helicopter parents?
Got it. Taking offense is a national sport.
Interesting. Back page of Time mag has an interesting interview on this with Judy Blume (the author known for getting her "young adult" novels banned lo these 40 years). She is asked about "trigger warnings" in class so *college* students can object if the professor is going to talk about an upsetting topic like... life. She is incredulous, basically saying: Isn't the whole point of college literature classes to confront young people with uncomfortable ideas? Apparently, the answer in 2015 is often "No."
>offspring of helicopter parents
No. But you've nailed it down better than by age bracket. Except it's not the offspring, it's the Dad himself.
>trigger
Saw that a week or so back. WTF! That's just an extension of helicoptering.
I'm a little older that demographic, have four kids (girls) -- two teens, a ten year old and a three year old. There are way to many emotions pouring out all the time, its getting ridiculous. Its getting to the point where I really look forward to the parts of the day where I get to interact with machines.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4EDhdAHrOg
I have to watch what I say and how I say it. Inevitably I'm the knuckle dragger that brings in a triple beef burger with bacon into the Vegan society picnic.
;D
Everyone, spent 20 years getting in touch with their inner child, now it's about time to get in touch with their inner adult.
To be honest, in my new work environment it's the older folks who are uptight, but that's a much different story. High end hotel and the older folks are still in a mode where they believe in "yes sir"/"no sir" and very formal language that, in my opinion, fewer and fewer guests want. I think it hampers our marketing, but it's literally on the level of correcting "Thanks Jack" to "Thank you" because it's perceived to be more formal. The result, in my opinion, is our marketing materials don't have a compelling voice, but... that's a whole different deal.
Formal is fine with me. I understand formal. Courtesy, manners and formality are the means by which total strangers who might not even like or understand each other can get things done, peacefully.
>they are *sure* I must be implying
They need to understand there is no need to read between the lines, if we want to say something we say it, simple.
>(girls) -- two teens
Ouch!
>knuckle-dragger
(#1) Yeah, me too. I was going to put "in touch with their feminine side" but figured Gurtie would think I'm chauvinistic ....which I'm not. Having raised 4 girls, I'm sorta pro-feminist. As long as they're female.
>if we want to say something we say it, simple
(#2) THAT'S a major part of the problem.
OK, I *think* I can tie 1 & 2 together with a joke; His & Her Diary From the Same Day
http://i.imgur.com/6icZ3.png
Quote from: Brad on June 08, 2015, 11:26:11 PM
Formal is fine with me. I understand formal.
It's fine and above all it is safe. But several major studies by the hotel industry in the last couple years have shown that it's no longer what people want, at least in the US. Essentially, the people who were looking for that kind of experience are getting too old to travel and the Boomers, Gen-X and Gen-Y are looking for unique, "authentic" and are made uneasy by that stiff formality.
The hotels are realizing that while formal scales, personal does not and there is great fear in the industry. AirBnB and VRBO aren't taking business because they are cheaper, but because the offer the experience the new generation is looking for. The huge change in the last couple of years is that hotels are increasingly losing business travelers to VRBO.
Anyway, that's a diversion from RC's issue, but it is a generational gap of some interest.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/business/young-travelers-drive-changes-in-hotel-industry.html?_r=0
http://adage.com/article/digitalnext/hotels-challenge-airbnb-millennials-hearts/297893/
>> stiff formality
This is a really snobbish comment, but I always feel like places and people who are stiffly formal are jusst trying to appear better than they really are. I get the same feeling in/around them as I do when people having an allegedly private conversation are speaking too loudly aboout something 'amazing' to try and impress you. (Nearly) all the really good places do casual dress and treat you like friends (ok I know that comes off their database but the TOV is still the same). There is a level though. Perhaps your guys need to go on a field trip?!
>> chauvinistic
Debbie would tell you off
>> in touch
Isn't this more about appropriateness? If you're in touch with your own feelings its polite to be in touch with others feelings too. If you're hugger and the person you're with isn't, then don't. If you're a sharer and the person you're with isn't - then rein it back a bit. If you know the person you're with is straight talking, snap yourself out of being oversensitive around them
But obviously the flip side of that RC, if you know the person ou're speaking to is liable to take everything to heart, perhaps dpn't use the full on Florida Man approach?
Hahaha, why am I not surprised that some of the.. errrm.. Emo Adults can't take your blunt approach RC.
I'm kind of with you though. In household with 3 girls as well (2, 8 and 11) and their friends coming over, I usually get flack for making their touchy-feely frineds cry. I might be kind of tough on them, but having 4 screaming 11 year olds roam the house does it for me and I tell them so and they break. Feeling it's unfair.. Geez. Some of these kids have never met any adult that tell them NO and they are used to having things their way.
Well, not in my house.. they can basically do what-ever as long as they respect everyone else in house and KEEP IT DOWN and clean up after them.
Seems like that tough love is good on kids though. Trying to find that blend between them communicating how they feel and when they should just get on with it. Stiff upper lip and all that!
>Emo Adults
I don't have much of a problem with EMO Females unless the emo is extreme. (Feigned emo, however, quickly detonates my onboard nukes.) I'm cognizant of the Venus vs Mars physiological/psychological/social issues and aware that a lot of that is wrong ...but some of it is right, too. I'm also aware that th3core has something of a Fight Club mentality, so I don't think we're typical. But this trend toward warm & fuzzy males is a PITA.
(FWIW, in the beginning of 'going public' , WMW was absolutely, 100% built using the Fight Club, anti-emo model.)
"blunt approach" per Viking MF
FUCK EM is they can't deal with....
Quote from: BoL on June 09, 2015, 09:25:53 AM
Stiff upper lip and all that!
The research
https://sites.sas.upenn.edu/duckworth/pages/research
The fluff piece on the research
http://americanradioworks.publicradio.org/features/tomorrows-college/grit/angela-duckworth-grit.html
Some other guy I never heard of but who came up when searching for the above
http://www.thelavinagency.com/blog-education-speaker-paul-tough-grit-test.html
RC - next time someone complains about your coarseness, you might have them take the grit test and then do a followup "counseling" session.
BTW, I work with people from 28 to just shy of retirement and my three closest co-workers currently are 28, 30, 39 and I have no complaints. They all enjoy a fair bit of good-natured ribbing and are all thankful for useful/constructive criticism. None of them are whiners or overly sensitive. We have some real blunt people around here. I would say respectful, but blunt. I have yet to hear someone complain about blunt (unreasonable, yes, but not blunt).
>Isn't this more about appropriateness? If you're in touch with your own feelings its polite to be in touch with others feelings too. If you're hugger and the person you're with isn't, then don't. If you're a sharer and the person you're with isn't - then rein it back a bit. If you know the person you're with is straight talking, snap yourself out of being oversensitive around them
That's not being appropriate, mirroring others feelings isn't the way to live your life. You need to be who you are, with all the constraints that polite society places on that of course.
There are only two rules:
Don't live your life in somebody else's imagination.
If some deadbeat son-in-law complains about not being able to get a good job, it's not your right to suggest he might want to take time out from call of duty to actually train and then look for a job. It is your responsibility to do so and if he doesn't listen a whoopsie around the head is a measured and appropriate response.
Over the last couple of years I've worked with a half-dozen young adults (21 to 28 y.o.), most of them have actually had a great attitude. I'm thinking that they just missed the 'helicopter parent' trend. I am trying my damndest to not be one of those btw.
Quote from: littleman on June 09, 2015, 03:57:05 PMI'm thinking that they just missed the 'helicopter parent' trend.
Based on my limited university teaching in the 1990s, I doubt they missed that trend. I think there have always been kids with grit and kids without. The problem with the younger crowd is they haven't been sifted yet. So they might have all the paper credentials, but nobody knows yet whether or not they have the other qualities that make people good to work with. Over time, on average, the ones without grit do not rise and so older people seem to have more grit, but because the ones from their generation without grit just simply aren't in leadership positions and have fallen to the level they can handle.
Reasonable theory or BS? I have no idea. I just made it.
>university
I'm only guessing but I wouldn't imagine LM's kids had ever seen the inside of a university?
It could just be that we get ever more "in touch with our emotions" until a major war comes along to reset it.
Quote from: nffc on June 09, 2015, 04:30:04 PM
I'm only guessing but I wouldn't imagine LM's kids had ever seen the inside of a university?
I'm just saying that products of helicopter parenting were already on the scene by the mid 1990s, so I don't think the 20-somethings that LM knows are too old to have missed out on being spoiled. They just weren't because every generation has its good and bad apples.