Ford will add iron phosphate battery options

[Brad]

Ford will add iron phosphate battery options for Mustang Mach-E and F-150 Lightning

https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/21/23272516/ford-electric-vehicle-batteries-lfp-lightning-mach-e

[rcjordan]

"Between the lines: Iron and phosphorous are abundant, which is why LFP cells cost at least 30% less than today's nickel- and cobalt-based batteries, Sam Abuelsamid, principal analyst at Guidehouse Insights, explains in Forbes.

LFP batteries are also more durable, lasting up to 1 million miles, per CATL.
And they're less likely to catch fire because the chemistry is more stable.

Yes, but: LFP batteries pack 30% less energy than similarly-sized nickel-rich batteries, which translates into shorter driving range.

This isn't a huge issue in China because buyers there care more about price and durability than driving range.
But Americans, who aspire to take long road trips, want longer-range EVs capable of going 300 miles or more between charges.
Instead of installing a larger battery to meet their range expectations, carmakers can squeeze more LFP cells into battery packs by redesigning their module structure, per Abuelsamid."

Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
https://www.axios.com/2022/07/22/ford-lithium-iron-phosphate-batteries

[Brad]

> And they're less likely to catch fire because the chemistry is more stable.

Aren't these the batteries Ergo was talking about for home power backup due to decreased fire risk? 

[rcjordan]

yes

[littleman]

Apparently lifepo4 batteries are so stable that you could drive a nail throw them without danger (I wouldn't try it though).

[ergophobe]

Yes. The main advantages are that they have lower risk of fire and that they lose capacity slower as you cycle them.

>>more durable, lasting up to 1 million miles

I don't think that's exactly the issue. I would state it, rather, that at 1 million miles, the battery capacity will be a higher percentage of the original capacity than a Li-Cobalt battery that has gone through as many charge cycles. But, of course, for a given weight, the other battery started with more capacity, so....

The main disadvantage is that the energy to weight ratio is worse as RC noted, which is why I didn't think we'd see them in cars.

The fire risk was the main reason I wanted them for the home, since the way we use them (backup mostly), I don't think the durability is a big issue. And of course, for a stationary battery, I couldn't care less about the energy-to-weight ratio

Of course anything can catch fire or cause a fire in the right (wrong) circumstances, but LiFePO4 batteries do not get radical resistance drops as they heat up, so are not subject to the same thermal runaway that happens with the Li-Cobalt chemistry. At least that's the theory.